LEWIS: The same boats in those days were rugged. LEWIS: No, trolling. LEWIS: I can even name the fellow who looked after the first big release on the Portobello Marine Station over there - Gerry Wing. What would you use on the hook? Whether it had ... you know a weak point? We found we would do better with just a 2 metre wide trace and a heavy monofilament. Do you recall any stomach contents from any of these White Pointers? Between 45 to 50 metres from the water level. You already said this was a very productive fish ground as well. CRAWFORD: That’s not the first time I’ve heard about that either. LEWIS: That would be in a line from Taiaroa Head to Aramoana, in the harbour. LEWIS: Just for keeping a record of the fish you’re tagging, the type of the Shark, the size of the Shark, the locality of the Shark, just the general science of the particular animals you’re catching. LEWIS: Oh, at the end we were definitely using barbless hooks. LEWIS: I’d say the majority of it is less than 6 metres of water. LEWIS: The dorsal fin is a true 'V'. On the outgoing tide, we set the drums, and I remember the 12-gallon drum going 'blup blup’ and then disappeared. Moeraki Township - again, it's you know, holiday camps and sort of carry on commercial port. LEWIS: Well, they were just so aggressive. Bear with me on the abundance issue. CRAWFORD: St. Clair, St. Kilda, what do you know about the circumstances? LEWIS: Well, the decision to employ the nets was based on the fact that there were fatalities over at the beaches, and the public perception that the nets would protect the beach. CRAWFORD: With regard to the Encounter Levels we discussed, of the 10 animals that you’ve seen in the outer harbour. New Zealand. So, with all the nets in the water, the more chance to get entangled. Other than say the incident I described where we had put the baited drums down. CRAWFORD: Ok. And now I’m just puttering around. And they fished for big Sharks. LEWIS: Yes, you can stagger the depths. Very seldom do we get more than six miles offshore. LEWIS: Very much so. Christchurch, Canterbury, 8013. Just people out in a dinghy, putting their net down to catch a fish in the harbour. CRAWFORD: Tell me about the different types of fishing gear, fishing vessels, that were used in the nearshore fishery. Patience was the essence. CRAWFORD: The slapping of the oar on the water? But look, I’m pretty sure that if a Shark, just again, it's only anecdotal, that if a White Shark decides that he is going to investigate you, the sheer bulk and size and nature doesn’t mean it’s a gentle thing. Very rare, but I know why we caught it in the harbour. LEWIS: Not really. The flow is automatically coming into the harbour. These Sharks, they’ll follow you in. It was late-50s, early-60s, but I can remember it vividly. He would harpoon them. Its girth was phenomenal. There’d be these big old hand carts for taking it. CRAWFORD: What was the smallest White Pointer you've seen here? And the far north, north of Whangaroa and trips up to the Three Kings Island, 15 nautical miles north of North Cape. LEWIS: The nets were randomly set parallel to the beach. CRAWFORD: The idea of submerged canyons, and the currents coming up? They must have known the times that this stuff was being dropped down. You mentioned places where the females were pupping. CRAWFORD: Let’s go offshore now. I believe the White Sharks are here at Otago because of the marine mammal population and the fish and that. CRAWFORD: So, you started Shark fishing prior to the protection for White Pointers? You could play within eyesight - that type of thing? They weren’t mid-water or anything like that. We were seasoned fishers by that time. (Page 3) LEWIS: Oh, well the tackle was not heavy to hang onto. And then there may have been another dozen in the fishing clubs who had no idea, but went through the motions. CRAWFORD: When you were on the water, was the nature of your activities in the region - did that stay pretty much the same? CRAWFORD: That's a big drum. What are the other things in life?" Yeah, once per month, twice a month. That was down on the container port. Like he would hook the Shark, and they would lance them with a big harpoon, you know? Picton couple Juliearna Kavanagh and Warren Lewis claim they've seen the mystery beast on the prowl near Ward, while driving on State Highway 1. You were about 40 years old? LEWIS: This bay here, we’ve seen three together moving north, near what we call Wickliffe Bay. This was the prior to the management scheme coming in, so you could get a permit enabling you to fish. See the complete profile on LinkedIn and discover Warren’s connections and jobs at similar companies. Lewis has owned the boat for nine years after arranging for a United States company to build it to requirements of New Zealand race-rules. CRAWFORD: At the point when you first doing this, you were maybe 16-17. As you get closer to your boat, the berley gets shallower, and your line. LEWIS: Yes. LEWIS: Yes. A big net of fish lying there was an attraction. Something in the brain says "I recognize that source or that type of source, and associate it with food or scent." CRAWFORD: There must be something then about the nature of recreational Shark fishing, in terms of the gear, the place, the technique, one way or another - that the White Pointers are simply not responding to? They used to team up, and used to use God forbid, the odd marine mammal for bait. LEWIS: Yes. CRAWFORD: I want to go back to the mindset of your father and grandfather’s generation, with regard to hunting White Pointers. LEWIS: Majority of that fishing was done here, due east of the Otago Peninsula. We saw them fishing Sharks several times over the years. The only finisher in the 400 class was HiJinx from Auckland. CRAWFORD: And the Groper was still alive, still flapping? Don’t quote me as that being gospel, but my recollection is there was not one. CRAWFORD: Tell me about the berley. CRAWFORD: If it was poor weather, they’d dump it in the harbour; and if it was ok, they would take it outside the harbour? You could never, ever give one. CRAWFORD: Therefore, you have not seen Dolphins running at White Pointers? Further south, I’m not sure, it was mentioned once around the Catlins, wherever it was down the way. CRAWFORD: Have you personally seen live White Pointers in Otago Harbour? LEWIS: That’s a big swim, I think it’s the longest recorded swim of a Blue Shark. CRAWFORD: Any indication that the Makos are feeding on Seals? Just bottom fishery. CRAWFORD: Was your adventure level fairly high? CRAWFORD: You also said that it was possible, I’m not sure if this is your thinking or your parents' or grandparents' generation, that there may have been something about the Taiaroa Head that potentially could have attracted them as well? Labour MP for Whanganui, including South Taranaki, and Stratford. Do you think it was mistaken identity? CRAWFORD: So, it was the bottom half, or bottom third of the water column that the nets were fishing? LEWIS: Goodness, yes. You could just see them, and they were gathered there. For example, on Saturday, I had a report from a fellow who we know, who went down for an early pass on Cape Saunders here, and he said he had a very big tail of a fish come out, behind the boat. They don’t blunder into things, they think. So, I spent time learning a trade in those years, but I was carrying on. Was it risk mitigation, at least in part? Seal and various Dolphin parts. So, we started out, and we floundered around, an excuse for fun. And one was swimming on a line, an old reel line for surf life saving. FMI is now has its headquarters in Auckland and employs more than 250 people throughout Australasia. LEWIS: Not multiple, no. LEWIS: All game fish. Because the tidal surge would be whipping in and out. But then, we went round down the coast, you know? We eventually joined, and for which I got heavily involved. Big hooks. Absolutely. I won’t pursue it - to the degree that I have sold my fast boat. Where and when were you born? CRAWFORD: Did you ever think there was a relationship between tidal conditions and the response of the Sharks? LEWIS: St. Clair beach, mainly. CRAWFORD: Would have been both upstream and downstream? And you saw them dumping? But I purchased an ex-commercial fishing boat, which is a large displacement boat, and it's extremely slow.

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